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#1
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Scolile publice italiene raman fara cruci
Unul din efectele multiculturalismului - spatiile publice trebuie sa fie "neutre" din punct de vedere religios.
Pe scurt, o mama (de origine finlandeza) s-a razboit timp de 8 ani cu autoritatile italiene pentru a-si atinge scopul, si-anume scoaterea crucifixelor din salile de clasa ale scolilor publice. Intr-un final s-a adresat Curtii Europene a Drepturilor Omului care i-a dat dreptate si a amendat statul italian cu suma de 5000 de euro. Curtea a concluzionat ca prezenta crucii in scoli poate constitui un factor perturbator pentru scolarii care nu sunt crestini sau care sunt atei. ROME – The Vatican on Tuesday denounced a ruling by the European court of human rights that said the display of crucifixes in Italian public schools violates religious and education freedoms. In a decision that could force a review of the use of religious symbols in government-run schools across Europe, the court ordered Italy to pay a euro5,000 ($7,390) fine to a mother in northern Italy who fought for eight years to have crucifixes removed from her children's public school classrooms. The Italian government said it would appeal. Vatican spokesman the Rev. Federico Lombardi said the crucifix was a fundamental sign of the importance of religious values in Italian history and culture and was a symbol of unity and welcoming for all of humanity — not one of exclusion. He said a European court had no right intervening in such a profoundly Italian matter and said "it seems as if the court wanted to ignore the role of Christianity in forming Europe's identity, which was and remains essential." "Religion gives a precious contribution to the formation and moral growth of people, and it's an essential component in our civilization," he said in a statement. "It's wrong and myopic to try to exclude it from education." The Strasbourg-based court said the crucifix could be disturbing to non-Christian or atheist pupils, rejecting arguments by Italy's government that it was a national symbol of culture, history, identity, tolerance and secularism. The court said secular, state-run schools must "observe confessional neutrality in the context of public education," where attendance is compulsory. But while it fined the government, the seven-judge panel stopped short of ordering Italy to remove the crucifixes, which are common in Italian public schools. The ruling can still be appealed to the European Court of Human Rights' Grand Chamber of 17 judges, whose decisions are binding. The case was brought by Soile Lautsi, a mother of two who claimed public schools in her northern Italian town refused eight years ago to remove the Roman Catholic symbols from classrooms. She had maintained that the crucifix violates the secular principles the public schools are supposed to uphold, and the right to offer her children a secular education. She filed her case with the European Court of Human Rights in July 2006, after Italy's Constitutional Court dismissed her complaint. Her efforts to rid public schools of religious symbols in a country that is predominantly Roman Catholic had not been welcomed. Lautsi, who is of Finnish origins, and her husband, Massimo Albertin, said they were satisfied. "We believe the ruling is a positive signal from Europe to Italy, which seems to increasingly lose its secularism," Albertin was quoted as saying by the ANSA news agency from his home in Albano Terme. "The crucifix creates discrimination." Still, the government maintained the crucifix is a symbol of Italian and European history and tradition. "In our country nobody wants to impose the Catholic religion, let alone with a crucifix," Education Minister Mariastella Gelmini said. But she added that "it is not by eliminating the traditions of individual countries that a united Europe is built." In its ruling, the court said the presence of the crucifix "could easily be interpreted by pupils of all ages as a religious sign and they would feel that they were being educated in a school environment bearing the stamp of a given religion." It added that the presence of such symbols could be "disturbing for pupils who practiced other religions or were atheists." Italian bishops said they were perplexed by the decision. "The multiple significance of the crucifix, which is not just a religious symbol but a cultural sign, has been either ignored or overlooked," the Italian Bishop's Conference said in a statement. Sursa: http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20091103/...igious_symbols
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Doamne Iisuse Hristoase, fiul lui Dumnezeu, miluieste-ma pe mine pacatoasa! Preach the Gospel and, if necessary, use words. |
#2
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Aceste hotariri sunt bazate pe frica, si teroarea care este INTENTIONAT raspindita in filmele de groaza care apar unul dupa altul.
Copiii au inceput sa identifice crucifixul cu arme de spart capete si omorit copii...asa cum vad ei non-stop la televizor pe anumite canale. Vad preoti criminali , violatori, care se bat in biserici cu demoni si alte timpenii de genul acesta. Scriitorii de scenarii tendentioase stiu la perfectie cum sa strecoare cite un crucifix in momentele cheie de formare a unei OPINII despre personaje. Deci nu-i de mirare ca femeia al carui copil este terorizat de cruci a cistigat in tribunal |
#3
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Problema asta are la baza un conflict mai mare.
Este vorba de anumite discriminari care se vor inlaturate. Sunt interzise simbolurile anumitor religii (basma, turban etc.), cursuri chiar (numai religia crestina, se preda in scoli) si atunci se doreste egalitate. Daca unii au interdictii, sa aibe toti. Ori au toti aceleasi drepturi, ori nici unul. Cam asta este explicatia. Se simt unii discriminati. Si cam au motiv. Sigur ca pe noi crestinii ne deranjeaza. Dar altii cum s-or simti. Aici de ex. copiii ortodocsi nu au ore de religie, trebuie sa faca etica, sau mai stiu eu. Este drept? |
#4
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Si la noi problema a fost tratata la fel de catre Curtea Constitutionala. Sunt curios daca cineva va face un recurs similar la aceeasi curte europeana. Oricum, salut decizia in cazul Italiei, este o miscare catre normalitate si una care se impune intr-un stat secular. Catolicii n-au decat sa faca scoli catolice unde sa impodobeasca peretii cu cruci, icoane, statui si ce doresc dumnealor.
Batalia nu cred ca s-a teminat nici in Romania.
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User vechi: scrabble. Last edited by hmiron; 03.11.2009 at 23:54:10. |
#5
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Citat:
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Biserica este dragoste, așteptare și bucurie. (Părintele Alexander Schmemann) |
#6
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Nu pot sustine cu date statistice aceasta afirmatie insa eu cred ca majoritatea celor "deranjati" de prezenta crucilor in salile de clasa sunt musulmani. Din cate stiu eu, Italia nu da pe-afara de atei, iar hindusilor si budistilor nu le sta in fire sa initieze astfel de proteste.
Ca atare vin si spun, daca e sa fie dreptate pe deplin, sa se scoata simbolurile religioase si din scolile tarilor musulmane. De fapt, in primul rand, sa fie incetata pe teritoriul acestor tari prigoana impotriva crestinilor, hindusilor, etc, iar mai apoi, in spiritul asta atat de aplaudat al egalitatii sanselor si al nepervertirii sufletelor copiilor, sa fie inlaturate toate elementele religioase din scoli. Sunt curioasa cu ce rezultat s-ar solda o actiune similara celei initiate de mama finlandeza impotriva unei tari populate in majoritate de musulmani. Si tot la Curtea pt. Apararea Drepturilor Omului.
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Doamne Iisuse Hristoase, fiul lui Dumnezeu, miluieste-ma pe mine pacatoasa! Preach the Gospel and, if necessary, use words. |
#7
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Citat:
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Pe noi inșine și unii pe alții și toată viața noastră lui Hristos Dumnezeu să o dăm. |
#8
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Citat:
Nu stiu de unde au intrat musulmanii in problema asta. Din cate am citit eu -- a femeie italianca get beget, mama, a facut proces la ECHR fiindca vrea sa le dea copiilor ei o educatie seculara, adica neinfluentata de religiozitate. De ce vrea ea chestia asta, ce o supara la religie si la crucifixe, si de ce crede ca vor fi copiii ei influentati asa de tare de o simpla cruce pe perete, asta e alta treaba. Dar, din cate vad eu, Europa Occidentala este din ce in ce mai seculara, deci ce face femeia asta si ce crede ea nu este chiar asa de iesit din context si din tipar. |
#9
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O spui de parca ar fi o noutate. Conceptele de baza ale UE promoveaza secularismul, iar majoritatea statelor membre, printre care si Romania, sunt seculare prin constitutie. Ca la noi se respecta mai putin treaba asta, e alta discutie.
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User vechi: scrabble. |
#10
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Hahahah, hmiron, nu e o noutate. Bineinteles, de o luuuunga perioada de timp, multe state europene s-au declarat seculare, incepand cu Franta si revolutia franceza. :D Ma refeream la societate. Statul secular prin constitutie este un lucru, societatea seculara este alta.
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